Finger shoot a 75% let-off compound?

Question:

The bow is 40" so thats not a problem for me. I’m more curious about getting a clean release while only holding 20 pounds or less. Is anyone shooting these bows with fingers? I’d sure like to switch over if its not going to be a problem. I think it would help with my traditional shooting if I got my compound shooting as similar as possible.

Response:

Sure, once you get used to the high let-off and low holding weight, there is not much difference. It will take a while to adapt, so don’t get discouraged. Stick with it. 40" axle to axle is short for fingers, in my opinion. 44 to 46 inches is better.

Response:

> 40" axle to axle is short for fingers, in my opinion. 44 to 46 inches is > better.

I’d agree, but I have a 40" bow.  The pinch is really not bad once past let-off. (I think the riser is long enough that its not a problem, I’ll have to try it and see)  I do miss my old 46" Laserflight some days…. Thanks for the input!

Response:

I shoot a 80 % let off bow with a finger tab and do not have a problem with a clean release. I think the big problem in a compound is finding a bow that is long 40 inch is about the right length for a finger shooter otherwise it is hard on your fingers….

Response:

I shoot a 40" bow using gloved fingers.  I started with 65% letoff and went to 50% letoff to try and improve my release.  It made no difference so I went back to 65%, but I do draw into the back wall of the draw curve before releasing the arrow.  I think it improves the crispness of my release.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> The bow is 40" so thats not a problem for me. I’m more curious about getting > a clean release while only holding 20 pounds or less. > Is anyone shooting these bows with fingers? > I’d sure like to switch over if its not going to be a problem. I think it > would help with my traditional shooting if I got my compound shooting as > similar as possible.

Response:

A lot depends on the quality of your shot. When beginning to shoot a low poundage bow the tendancy is to ease up a bit and actually shoot a dead release or a fake back tension shot. That’s the reason most shooters try to shoot at the wall, they focus on their form and follow thru at that point. — Cathy Korby Archery Coach

Response:

> A lot depends on the quality of your shot. > When beginning to shoot a low poundage bow > the tendancy is to ease up a bit and actually shoot > a dead release or a fake back tension shot. > That’s the reason most shooters try to shoot at the > wall, they focus on their form and follow thru at > that point.

Cathy, I hope your still watching this thread? I tried the finger release with this bow and now know exactly what you posted about. It is hard to keep from creeping with a hard cam.  I did get better results pulling against the wall with a constant finger pressure, then pushing away with the bow arm to increase tension for the release. Shooting with a tab seems to work better than the glove too. Probably because of the limited amount of finger space for a 40" bow. I’d call it a success so far. I am much more comfortable shooting with a finger in my mouth for an anchor instead of using a peep to squint through and  a kisser and a low mechanical release anchor point. My main goals in moving to a manual release was so I could shoot with both eyes open, get a higher anchor and most of all, to develop my natural archery skills rather than my "point and shoot" skills. Something I’ll be able to apply to insinctive shooting of the recurve. Another benefit has been improving on my target panic. !

Response:

Measuring draw length?

Question:

> Greetings all, >         Just curious as to the nuances of measuring ones draw length. > I have been shooting my bow for several years now (bought from a > friend) and have no idea what muy draw length is.  It feels perfect, > but I will soon be shopping for a new bow and want to be sure to get > one that fits as well as this one.  All help is appreciated. > bol

Hi, just ask a friend to draw a line on your arrow in height of your arrow rest when you are in full draw, then measure it from nock pit to this line. Jens Nober

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Greetings all, >         Just curious as to the nuances of measuring ones draw length. > I have been shooting my bow for several years now (bought from a > friend) and have no idea what muy draw length is.  It feels perfect, > but I will soon be shopping for a new bow and want to be sure to get > one that fits as well as this one.  All help is appreciated. > bol > Hi, > just ask a friend to draw a line on your arrow in height of your arrow > rest when you are in full draw, then measure it from nock pit to this > line. > Jens Nober

…then measure it from nock pit (or the deepest place on your bow grip) to this line and add 1 3/4 inch for AMO draw lenght. Charlotte

Response:

: > Hi, : > : > just ask a friend to draw a line on your arrow in height of your arrow : > rest when you are in full draw, then measure it from nock pit to this : > line. : > : > Jens Nober : …then measure it from nock pit (or the deepest place on your bow grip) to : this line and add 1 3/4 inch for AMO draw : lenght. : Charlotte This works IF your rest is in line with the back of your grip.  On most bows, the rest mounting hole is vertically alligned with the back of the grip at it’s most forward point.  True draw is actually defined to be the the distance from the most rearward portion of the string to the most forward portion of the grip at full draw.  The measurement techniques suggested work just fine given the requirement of the rest/grip allignment. My bow happens to have the rest mounting holes well back of the grip position. -Scot — Scot E. Heath, P.E.                      "Nothing beats turning clay to dust." Fort Collins, CO

Response:

  Being that you said you bought your bow from a friend, it makes me wonder if the bow is the proper draw for you now. Buying a bow with to long a draw lengh is probably one of the most command mistakes made in archery.    Finding a bow that is comfortable for you takes time and shooting. to by a bow from a friend because the price is right isn’t the answer, you may have a bow now that is to long for you and have just got into shooting it with bad form. These types of habits are hard to break and it may take some time to overcome them now.   The best advice i could tell you, would go to see your local Pro shop and get some expert advice. You may find out the bow you are shooting now is to long or short of draw lengh, and getting one that fits you exact will be the difference in hitting more 10 rings or vitals.                 Rick

Response:

> Greetings all, >         Just curious as to the nuances of measuring ones draw length. > I have been shooting my bow for several years now (bought from a > friend) and have no idea what muy draw length is.  It feels perfect, > but I will soon be shopping for a new bow and want to be sure to get > one that fits as well as this one.  All help is appreciated. > bol

If you’re own your own, put a piece of masking tape (or a post-it) on your arrow, and draw. See how far from <some reference> the "tag" is. Adjust tag on arrow. Repeat until the "tag" lines up exactly. Now measure. Other posts have told you WHERE to take the measurements.         BugBear

Response:

I found sprinkling some powder on the tip end of the shaft, (flour, foot powder, talcum) then measuring to where the line in the powder ends, works great, and is very accurate.  (If you wipe the shaft off with a clean dry rag first, it causes a static buildup, then a very fine coating of flour sticks after you tap the heavy buildup off) I then measure from the spot on the rest that has the little buildup of powder on it, to the back of the handle, add the two numbers, and there’s my AMO drawlength Al… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> If you’re own your own, put a piece of masking tape (or a post-it) > on your arrow, and draw. See how far from <some reference> the "tag" > is. Adjust tag on arrow. Repeat until the "tag" lines up exactly. > Now measure. > Other posts have told you WHERE to take the measurements. > BugBear

Response:

>Greetings all, >    Just curious as to the nuances of measuring ones draw length. >I have been shooting my bow for several years now (bought from a >friend) and have no idea what muy draw length is.  It feels perfect, >but I will soon be shopping for a new bow and want to be sure to get >one that fits as well as this one.  All help is appreciated. >bol

Try this;         Get some one with a marker pen silver or white will do to stand at the side of you. if possible fit a clicker, at ten or fifteen yards from the boss With your eyes SHUT draw as normal and get your friend to mark the shaft at the back of the clicker. Still with your eyes shut do this several times. Don’t cut your arrow to this length but place your pile so that have of it is bellow the mark, remark and cut.     When you draw normal as soon as you put back pressure on the clicker will click and you should not feel any strain. NEIL

Response:

Axis Evaluation

Question:

Would anyone be interested in submitting opinions, test reports, comparisons and personal views on Hoyt’s new Axis. Findings to be published in a feature report in BOW International magazine. You can use this newsgroup if you want to start an interesting thread OR you can email them directly to myself (the Editor). Richard White

Response:

Sorry…preferably with FX limbs although comparisons with other limbs may be worthy of an extended feature. Richard

Response:

>Would anyone be interested in submitting opinions, test reports, >comparisons and personal views on Hoyt’s new Axis. Findings to be >published in a feature report in BOW International magazine. >You can use this newsgroup if you want to start an interesting thread >OR you can email them directly to myself (the Editor).

Yes I will give you one. I have ordered Fx Limbs and five months later am still waiting:< Regards  Tony Marturano St George Archers www.post-polionetwork.org.au/archery/ ICQ# 19175889

Response:

Well, if you want to lend me one I’ll shoot it for you…

Response:

I’m not in the business of providing bows for evaluation but can try to arrange for a dealer to let you borrow one for half a day….UK only. I normally have no problems from volunteers  who already have the bow or have access to one. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >This is a multi-part message in MIME format. >Content-Type: text/plain; >    charset="iso-8859-1" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >Well, if you want to lend me one I’ll shoot it for you… >Content-Type: text/html; >    charset="iso-8859-1" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >=FF=FE<=00!=00D=00O=00C=00T=00Y=00P=00E=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = >=00P=00U=00B=00L=00I=00C=00 = >=00"=00-=00/=00/=00W=003=00C=00/=00/=00D=00T=00D=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = >=004=00.=000=00 = >=00T=00r=00a=00n=00s=00i=00t=00i=00o=00n=00a=00l=00/=00/=00E=00N=00"=00>=0 0= >=0D=00=0A= >=00<=00H=00T=00M=00L=00>=00<=00H=00E=00A=00D=00>=00=0D=00=0A= >=00<=00M=00E=00T=00A=00 = >=00c=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00t=00=3D=00"=00t=00e=00x=00t=00/=00h=00t=00m=00= >l=00;=00 = >=00c=00h=00a=00r=00s=00e=00t=00=3D=00u=00n=00i=00c=00o=00d=00e=00"=00 = >=00h=00t=00t=00p=00-=00e=00q=00u=00i=00v=00=3D=00C=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00= >t=00-=00T=00y=00p=00e=00>=00=0D=00=0A= >=00<=00M=00E=00T=00A=00 = >=00c=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00t=00=3D=00"=00M=00S=00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = >=005=00.=000=000=00.=002=009=001=009=00.=006=003=000=007=00"=00 = >=00n=00a=00m=00e=00=3D=00G=00E=00N=00E=00R=00A=00T=00O=00R=00>=00=0D=00=0A = >=00<=00S=00T=00Y=00L=00E=00>=00<=00/=00S=00T=00Y=00L=00E=00>=00=0D=00=0A= >=00<=00/=00H=00E=00A=00D=00>=00=0D=00=0A= >=00<=00B=00O=00D=00Y=00 = >=00b=00g=00C=00o=00l=00o=00r=00=3D=00#=00f=00f=00f=00f=00f=00f=00>=00=0D=0 0=0A= >=00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00<=00F=00O=00N=00T=00 = >=00s=00i=00z=00e=00=3D=002=00>=00W=00e=00l=00l=00,=00 =00i=00f=00 = >=00y=00o=00u=00 =00w=00a=00n=00t=00 =00t=00o=00 =00l=00e=00n=00d=00 = >=00m=00e=00 =00o=00n=00e=00 =00I=00′=00l=00l=00 =00s=00h=00o=00o=00t=00 = >=00i=00t=00 =00f=00o=00r=00 =00=0D=00=0A= >=00y=00o=00u=00.=00.=00.=00<=00/=00F=00O=00N=00T=00>=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=0 0= >=00=0D=00=0A= >=00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00>=00=0D = >=00=0A= >=00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00>=00=0D = >=00=0A= >=00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00>=00<=0 0= >/=00B=00O=00D=00Y=00>=00<=00/=00H=00T=00M=00L=00>=00=0D=00=0A= >=00

Response:

Sorry, I am Irish lad

Response:

Ewan, please be careful about all the junk included in your posts. Plain text is better and more readable. Having to wade through reams of ascii characters (which is what the encoded graphics, or whatever they are, come through as), to find your posts tends to irritate people. Thanks. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > Content-Type: text/plain; >    charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Well, if you want to lend me one I’ll shoot it for you… > Content-Type: text/html; >    charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > =FF=FE<=00!=00D=00O=00C=00T=00Y=00P=00E=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = > =00P=00U=00B=00L=00I=00C=00 = > =00"=00-=00/=00/=00W=003=00C=00/=00/=00D=00T=00D=00

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Before you buy.

Response:

>Sorry, I am Irish lad

I’m sorry about that too. Besides your newsprogram is broken. It sends html, not plain text. MA

Response:

oneida eagle owners

Question:

Anyone out there who owns an oneida eagle bow. What do you use it for mostly, how do you like it?

Response:

So, you’d say they are noisy compared to other bows?  Would you say that precision-wise they are as good as about any similar priced bow?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Although I haven’t shot one since I switched to longbow, I still own several, > including a Stealth Eagle, and used them for everything from target to 3D to > hunting. > Nice shooters if you can stand the noise. > A man that straddles the fence, gets a sore crotch

Response:

Yeah, they due tend to be a touch louder than cam bows. It has to do with the string slapping the limb (like a recurve) and the limbs snapping together. There are various tricks that Oneida shooters have learned over the years to combat this. If you check their website, you can read some of them. As far as are they a good deal, I’d say you do get your money’s worth, especially on Lite Force and Lite Force Mag. Two of the best buys on the market. A man that straddles the fence, gets a sore crotch

Response:

Lovely bow.  My second bow was a screaming eagle and though I have several different bows by various manufacturers (mostly PSE) since (it was stolen), I am contemplating the purchase of a new one as I give my current hunting bow to my eldest son.  What I always liked about the Oneida was its smoothness.  I had some mechanical problems with the bow, but those have since been addressed with the newer models.  As a hunting bow I find that it has a a number of advantages; At full draw you can rest the tip of the limb on your knee and hold the bow at draw for quite some time.  This was particularly useful hunting whitetails in the swamp on the ground where the drawing movement was a disadvantage.  Secondly, unlike all these one-cam bows, you can actually change a string in the field and get your bow shooting right in a minimum amount of time should you suffer an accident of some sort. I am an avid target shooter, so I expect a high degree of accuracy when I tune and shoot a bow.  The Oneidas are as good as any bow I’ve shot. Andy P. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Anyone out there who owns an oneida eagle bow. > What do you use it for mostly, how do you like it?

Response:

I have an old oneida eagle i think its great i used to use it for target archery and it worked well for me. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Anyone out there who owns an oneida eagle bow. > What do you use it for mostly, how do you like it?

Response:

I have an oneida golden eagle bow and have no problem killing deer with it. 30 in draw, 65#, 65% let-off. Very quiet with catwhiskers tied on at the string loops. a bit noisier with carbon but still have taken three deer in three years with two arrows,( reused same arrow second and third year) two spine shots with it, dropped seven deer in seven years with it. Very pleased with oneida and Muzzy broadheads.

Response:

   I have owned and shot an onieda x-80 for the last 3 years and shot Pro-line,PSE and Browning before that. I wouldn’t take anything away from these or any other bows, but something just "clicked " with me and this Onieda. I am an instinctive shooter and shoot this bow off the shelf, no rest no sights no nothin. I took six deer last year 5 of these with the same arrow. I know what your thinking, yeah right!  This bow I would not trade for anything. It lends itself real well to my style of shooting, its what I have been looking for  a long time. A little noisy but I have heard worse. One thing that needs to be mentioned here is for hunting you need to be more aware of branches above and below your bow as the limbs flex much more than a regular compound bow, and you need to allow for much more clearance. Try before you buy if you can, I’m looking for another cause I’m gonna wear this one out! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Anyone out there who owns an oneida eagle bow. > What do you use it for mostly, how do you like it?

Response:

oriental archery

Question:

In Hungary, where I live at the moment, there are quite a number of excellent oriental-type bows available: traditional Hungarian and Turkish recurves, etc (some local makes and some imports from Korea and elsewhere).  I can shoot them fine with fingers, but the traditional way is with a thunb ring.  Making a thumb ring does not seem to be much of a problem, but I need advice on its employment. I read somewhere, that with thumb release you put the arrow on the same side as the release hand (as the Japaneese do).  Is this the case?  Is this a procedure required by tradition, or requred by physics? Thanks for your advice. Peter Kiss Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

> Making a thumb ring does not seem to be much >of a problem, but I need advice on its employment. >I read somewhere, that with thumb release you put the arrow on the same >side as the release hand (as the Japaneese do).  Is this the case?  Is >this a procedure required by tradition, or requred by physics?

Peter, When using the thumb ring release, the arrow will go on the opposite side from when you use a three-finger release.  The reason being, when using a t-ring, the index finger of your draw hand pushes the arrow into the bow; if you had it on the same side as the 3F, it would tend to push the arrow off the bow.  There have been historical exceptions to this, but that is the general rule. As for the correct useage of the t-ring, the string will fit between the ring and thumb at the inner knuckle of the draw hand.  Close your index finger around the thumb, like you are going to flip a coin; you may wish to put a little bit more of your index finger over the thumb tip (whatever makes it feel more comfortable).  When nocked, the arrow will rest in the crease between the thumb and forefinger.  Draw the string back (in Korea, it’s usually near the draw shoulder, with a slightly floating anchor).  When you reach anchor, release by relaxing the draw hand.  Be patient; it usually takes a week or two of steady practice to get used to it. If you give me your address, I’ll send you a two-page pamphlet I made on thumb ring use. Good luck. Thomas http://www.ncmc.cc.mi.us/esl/korarch.html

Response:

> Be patient; it usually >takes a week or two of steady practice to get used to it.

Thomas, you were a child prodigy! the rest of us however….. I’m using a ring I got from Thomas, made in Korea. at 20 yards, I’m averaging 90% hits on a standard 18"? diameter target.I started with the thumb-ring in late March. I’m using a Kassai Mongol, 37# at 32" and arrows by Arrow Art. spine is critical here, since even though the handle is narrow, its still not center-shot.  Nick

Response:

> Be patient; it usually >takes a week or two of steady practice to get used to it. >Thomas, you were a child prodigy! the rest of us however…..

Gee, if at near-forty I’m a child prodigy, my parents, in their 70’s must just be starting the prime of their life!  <G>  I’ll be sure to tell them Thomas

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Making a thumb ring does not seem to be much >of a problem, but I need advice on its employment. >I read somewhere, that with thumb release you put the arrow on the same >side as the release hand (as the Japaneese do).  Is this the case? Is >this a procedure required by tradition, or requred by physics? > Peter, > When using the thumb ring release, the arrow will go on the opposite side > from when you use a three-finger release.  The reason being, when using a > t-ring, the index finger of your draw hand pushes the arrow into the bow; if > you had it on the same side as the 3F, it would tend to push the arrow off > the bow.  There have been historical exceptions to this, but that is the > general rule. > As for the correct useage of the t-ring, the string will fit between the > ring and thumb at the inner knuckle of the draw hand.  Close your index > finger around the thumb, like you are going to flip a coin; you may wish to > put a little bit more of your index finger over the thumb tip (whatever > makes it feel more comfortable).  When nocked, the arrow will rest in the > crease between the thumb and forefinger.  Draw the string back (in Korea, > it’s usually near the draw shoulder, with a slightly floating anchor).  When > you reach anchor, release by relaxing the draw hand.  Be patient; it usually > takes a week or two of steady practice to get used to it. > If you give me your address, I’ll send you a two-page pamphlet I made on > thumb ring use. > Good luck. > Thomas > http://www.ncmc.cc.mi.us/esl/korarch.html

Thomas, Thank you.  I will appreciate the pamphlet.  My address is Peter A. Kiss 2145 Szilasliget Ady E. u. 34 Hungary Peter Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >I read somewhere, that with thumb release you put the arrow on the >same > >side as the release hand (as the Japaneese do).  Is this the case? >Is > >this a procedure required by tradition, or requred by physics? > Peter, > When using the thumb ring release, the arrow will go on the opposite >side > from when you use a three-finger release.  The reason being, when >using a > t-ring, the index finger of your draw hand pushes the arrow into the >bow; if > you had it on the same side as the 3F, it would tend to push the >arrow off > the bow.  There have been historical exceptions to this, but that is >the > general rule.

The other reason is that on release the string slips off the thumb to the right (for a right handed archer), flexing the arrow nock in the same direction, and the centre of the arrow bows out to the left. Then, while passing the bow’s grip, the arrow centre flexes to the right, clearing the grip without striking it. It takes only a few miliseconds for the two oscillations.  Exactly the opposite happens for a right handed shooter and three finger release with the arrow on the left side of the bow.  As Thomas mentioned, there were and are people who shoot with arrows on the left side, I tried this once and it did not work for me. Adam

Response:

>Thomas, >Thank you.  I will appreciate the pamphlet.  My address is >Peter A. Kiss >2145 Szilasliget >Ady E. u. 34 >Hungary

I’ll have one sent out to you. Best, Thomas

Response:

Archers advantage software

Question:

Has anyone used the "archers advantage" software? If so does it work?

Response:

I have been using the software for about 3 years now, and it is one of the best investments that I have made. It can save you hours or even days of sighting in your bow. And it is accurate out to 100 yards.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Has anyone used the "archers advantage" software? >If so does it work?

Response:

A very good investment, saves time and it is very accurate especially when you know your arrow speed with a chronograph. —

Response:

> Has anyone used the "archers advantage" software? > If so does it work?

 Hi there Nancy Nurse.. hehehe    The answer(s) are yes..and not for me.. I do not have an arrow speed checker (Cronograph??) and it depends mainly on your arrow speed it seems. I still use the old PSE yardage chart from 4/1/74 (No not an April fools joke either) This works across the board on most yardage for all bows. I simply shoot in a mark (in my case) 30 yards and 60 yards.. put those transfer those over to a piece of paper then line them up on the chart.. mark the rest on the paper from the chart and go shooting.. Hope this helped you some.. and SHARPEN that needle PULEEEEEEEEEZE! hahaha wPm —  S&B Enterprises     Sunland,CA. 91040 ‘..the MOUNTAINS are calling and I must go! <John Muir>

Response:

Hello Steve, Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I do not recommend using a chronograph with Archer’s Advantage (at least not without calibrating the software to your chronograph).  You can’t get two chronographs to agree on arrow speed much less my software and a chronograph. For example, lets say you have access to two chronographs and one is 3 fps faster than the other.  Which chronograph do you trust?  If you pick the wrong one and print out a sight tape from Archer’s Advantage using that chrono-speed, here’s what will happen.  Most people use their 20 yard mark as a reference with their Archer’s Advantage sight tape.  If you set up your sight with a good 20 yard mark but have the arrow speed off by 3 fps, you will shoot roughly 3-4 inches high or low of center at 80 yards.  I will never advertise that Archer’s Advantage is more accurate than anyone’s chronograph at determining arrow speed.  However, if you rely on Archer’s Advantage calculated arrow speed to print out sight tapes, I guarantee that you can get good marks from the software out past 100 yards.  In fact, James Despart (Former NFAA National Champion) has checked out Archer’s Advantage sight tapes on his bow to 120 yards and says that the sight tape is still dead on at that range.  He would not have been able to obtain this kind of accuracy by relying on a chronograph speed. Good Shooting! Perry

Response:

: Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I do not recommend using a chronograph : with Archer’s Advantage (at least not without calibrating the software to your : chronograph).  You can’t get two chronographs to agree on arrow speed much : less my software and a chronograph. But if you don’t get a chance to shoot the longer distances very much, you can use a single mark and a chronograph to get you in the right ballpark. I used AA to shoot a FITA once and found that the settings were pretty consistantly one yard short. So I made another tape with the speed a few fps slower and the tape was right on. The new version looks like it’s going to be a winner too since it will compensate automagically for the actual drag of the arrow rather than just calculating it. I really look forward to it.         Marty Sasaki

Response:

This sounds like something I could use!! Where do I get it and what does it cost?

Response:

How did James Despart check out his sight tape  to 120 yards.  I thought they only printed out tapes to 100 yards. Or does the new version go farther then 100 yds. Bruce.  In fact, James Despart – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->(Former NFAA National Champion) has checked out Archer’s Advantage sight tapes >on his bow to 120 yards and says that the sight tape is still dead on at that >range.  He would not have been able to obtain this kind of accuracy by relying >on a chronograph speed. >Good Shooting! >Perry

Response:

Hello Bruce, The latest version allows you to select the maximum range of the tape, from 50 yards/meters out to 150 yards/meters.  There are a number of other enhancements as well.  Upgrades are only $10.  Send your original distribution disk and $10 to the address shown in your About Box and I will upgrade you to the latest version. Good Shooting! Perry

Response:

Visit www.archersadvantage.com.  You should find the information you are interested in, as well as various articles on archery (some previously published in US Archer and Archery Focus magazines). Good Shooting! Perry

Response:

Has anyone else used the old Check-it sights rubber band with the scale on it, Pretty cool huh?

Response:

Yes I have used it and it works.

Martin Fury vs. Hoyt Viper!!

Question:

A buddy of mine runs a archery shop and is a Hoyt dealer he got this new viper in and I have a 96 Martin Fury we shot through the chronograph and we measured weight of the bow measured the draw length and the whole 9 ytds everthing was the same my fury shot 318fps and this new viper that was supposed to be faster shot 295 and we shot a dozen times and still the fury was much faster needless to say i left with a real big smile!! Regaurds Brian

Response:

Just curious .. did you shoot the same arrows?  Was EVERYTHIGN except the bow different?  Like was even the rest the same?  The release was same? Did you change bow between friends?  DId each of you shoot each shot? Although things like a release, rest, sight, etc. everything you think wouldn’t affect speed shouldn’t affect the speed of the bow, it might make a difference.  I’d say really to make sure everything was even, the bows were bare, exact same poundage, same tiller if possible and brace height, u both use the same arrows, and u both shoot each of the bows. Han Su Kim

Response:

> A buddy of mine runs a archery shop and is a Hoyt dealer he got this new viper > in and I have a 96 Martin Fury we shot through the chronograph and we measured > weight of the bow measured the draw length and the whole 9 ytds everthing was > the same my fury shot 318fps and this new viper that was supposed to be faster > shot 295 and we shot a dozen times and still the fury was much faster needless > to say i left with a real big smile!! > Regaurds Brian

This is just my 2 cents worth, but I had to reply because I shoot for Hoyt. I have a 99 Viper with the Redline H.O. setup on it. I set my bow at 66 pounds and I have a 29" draw length. Shawn

Response:

>A buddy of mine runs a archery shop and is a Hoyt dealer he got this new viper >in and I have a 96 Martin Fury we shot through the chronograph and we measured >weight of the bow measured the draw length and the whole 9 ytds everthing was >the same my fury shot 318fps and this new viper that was supposed to be faster >shot 295 and we shot a dozen times and still the fury was much faster needless >to say i left with a real big smile!! >Regaurds Brian

You have to consider, that viper was a new bow. I guess, you have been trimming the fury, for best results. If you would do the same with the viper its speed would increase. Tonny

Response:

 This is for Shawn, Shawn I was wondering how forgiving your viper is I’ve been looking at them and trying to decide on it or not. I realize with a 51/2" brace height it can’t be to forgiving but would like an honest opinion on how it shoots and acts. Rick – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> A buddy of mine runs a archery shop and is a Hoyt dealer he got this new viper > in and I have a 96 Martin Fury we shot through the chronograph and we measured > weight of the bow measured the draw length and the whole 9 ytds everthing was > the same my fury shot 318fps and this new viper that was supposed to be faster > shot 295 and we shot a dozen times and still the fury was much faster needless > to say i left with a real big smile!! > Regaurds Brian > This is just my 2 cents worth, but I had to reply because I shoot for > Hoyt. > I have a 99 Viper with the Redline H.O. setup on it. > I set my bow at 66 pounds and I have a 29" draw length. > Shawn

Response:

Buckmaster?????

Question:

I am buying my first bow. I will use it for hunting. I am thinking about a Jennings Buckmaster. Any opinions??? Bob Kennedy

Response:

Although I don’t own one and I’m not a hunter or big on compounds in general, the Jennings is nto a bad bow for the money.  It seems to do it’s job okay, and for the price it’s not bad at all. Han Su Kim

Response:

  In my opinion the "Buckmaster" is over priced and over rated. There are many fine bows that will out perform at less cost. All you are buying is a name. My wife left!! Wonder who’s gonna clean this deer now?

Response:

>  In my opinion the "Buckmaster" is over priced and over rated. There are many >fine bows that will out perform at less cost. All you are buying is a name.

I second that !!! — Bye, Sven

Response:

>I am buying my first bow. I will use it for hunting. I am thinking about >a Jennings Buckmaster. Any opinions???

Go to: http://listings.ebay.com/aw/listings/list/category383/index.html and look for a  MARTIN FURY. A better bow for a better price. btw: The bows are NEW !!! — Bye, Sven

Response:

I purchased a Buckmaster bow last year and I must tell you I Really like it I dont think you will go wrong with it.It isn’t the fastest bow on the market but is well balanced and shoots very well with great power.I shoot xx78 super slams with 85 gr. tips and overdraw it shoots consistently 250fps. I have enjoyed mine very much. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I am buying my first bow. I will use it for hunting. I am thinking about > a Jennings Buckmaster. Any opinions??? > Bob Kennedy

Response:

Ok bob here is my view on that bow my father and i own a archery shop in ohio and we are a bear/jennings dealer i owend a buckmaster the first year they came out i got ride of mine cause the vibration and how it hit me in my wrist no matter how u hold it it hits u my father still loves his..we sold around 30 last year and had no complants..they have 4 buckmasters for "99" the buckmaster "pwc" which is a great bow  they re desinged it  the seem very nice hope it works out for u if u need any other help write me back

Response:

> I am buying my first bow. I will use it for hunting. I am thinking about > a Jennings Buckmaster. Any opinions??? > Bob Kennedy

After shooting a PSE for 7 years, I wanted a second bow, so I bought a Buckmaster too. With my PSE EDGE 50 50 serie, I got quite few deer, 2 black bears and small game. My buckmaster is still on my wall, waiting that my PSE die, then I`ll use it. Why? It vibrates a lot, too much recoil, the Zebra string and cables stretch way too much(in 2 weeks almost 1 and 1/2 inches) and  it is very noisy. About speed? With the same arrows, same poundage, my old PSE is 27fps faster than the Buckmaster. That is why is still hanging on my wall.

Response:

rather have a Browning BloodBrother or a selfbow. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I am buying my first bow. I will use it for hunting. I am thinking > about > a Jennings Buckmaster. Any opinions??? > Bob Kennedy > After shooting a PSE for 7 years, I wanted a second bow, so I bought a > Buckmaster too. With my PSE EDGE 50 50 serie, I got quite few deer, 2 > black bears and small game. My buckmaster is still on my wall, waiting > that my PSE die, then I`ll use it. Why? It vibrates a lot, too much > recoil, the Zebra string and cables stretch way too much(in 2 weeks > almost 1 and 1/2 inches) and  it is very noisy. About speed? With the > same arrows, same poundage, my old PSE is 27fps faster than the > Buckmaster. That is why is still hanging on my wall.

Response:

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Pardon me, Sir, what is that for a bullsh….  ???? — Bye, Sven

Response:

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Your newsreader is corrupt. Or could it really be, that you use a browser for the newsgroups? — Bye, Sven

Response:

?point blank?

Question:

In another group somebody posted: Adrian Eliot Hodgkin in his book The Archer’s Craft writes: "All I can say with assurance is that the bows I make for myself, according to the methods given here, WEIGH ABOUT 60 lb. and have a point blank-range of SEVENTY-ODD YARDS with birch arrows and SEVENTY TO EIGHTY YARDS with bamboos. By ‘point-blank’ I mean that that range at which the center of the target will be hit when aim is taken in such a way that the arrowhead seems to rest on that center." I don’t have access to the Archer’s Craft so I would like to ask a couple of questions… 1) please explain in words of one sylable what the above paragraph    means. 2) Does the book talk about how frequently Mr. Hodgkin practices? 3) Does anyone here know of anyone who can fairly consistantly    hit bullseyes at 70 yards? Thank you for your time and trouble. Robert

Response:

I’ll try ;-> When I am set up with my longbow, the easiest way to aim (no sights) is to place the point of the arrow on the bullseye and let fly. With my setup, I hit home at around 40 yards. With the authors, the figures he gave. How often do I (or he) actually HIT the bullseye at that range !? Another question entirely ;-> RW – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Adrian Eliot Hodgkin in his book The Archer’s Craft writes: >"All I can say with assurance is that the bows I make for myself, >according to the methods given here, WEIGH ABOUT 60 lb. and have a >point blank-range of SEVENTY-ODD YARDS with birch arrows and SEVENTY >TO EIGHTY YARDS with bamboos. By ‘point-blank’ I mean that that range >at which the center of the target will be hit when aim is taken in >such a way that the arrowhead seems to rest on that center."

Response:

The origin of the phrase point blanc is the distance at which the point of the arrow is aimed on the target at full draw to hit the target. With an under the chin reference (anchor) it will be around 60-70yds. At lesser distances the pont of the arrow will be aimed under the target (blanc) At longer distances the point of the arrow will be over the target. Some how the gun shooters have taken the phrase to mean shooting at short range. We shoot for golds not bullseyes, it is not difficult to get 4 or 5 out of 6 in the gold, with the other 1 or 2 in the red at 60 yds.

Response:

>The origin of the phrase point blanc is the distance at which the point of the >arrow is aimed on the target at full draw to hit the target. With an under the >chin reference (anchor) it will be around 60-70yds. At lesser distances the >pont of the arrow will be aimed under the target (blanc) At longer distances >the point of the arrow will be over the target. Some how the gun shooters have >taken the phrase to mean shooting at short range.

Thank you very much. >We shoot for golds not bullseyes, it is not difficult to get 4 or 5 out of 6 in >the gold, with the other 1 or 2 in the red at 60 yds.

If you would be so kind… Using modern bows I assume? How much practice is assumed here? What is the diameter of the gold? Thanks again for the input. Robert

Response:

I haven’t read Hodgkin’s book either,  but I’m pretty sure what he is discussing is gap shooting.  When he draws the bow back to his anchor point, he then uses the tip of the arrow as an aiming point.  Seventy – eighty yards is quite far, especially for a selfbow, so I would assume he uses a low anchor point, probably something like just below his jaw and possibly as far back as his ear?  And no, I doubt Eliot Hodgin was able to hit CONSISTANT bullseye at those distances.  That is a diffiucult challenge for most sight shooters; however, I’m sure Hodgking was able to establish a grouping in and around the bullseye and thus was able to determine what his point-on distance was for his style of shooting. Stuart Ware

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > In another group somebody posted: > Adrian Eliot Hodgkin in his book The Archer’s Craft writes: > "All I can say with assurance is that the bows I make for myself, > according to the methods given here, WEIGH ABOUT 60 lb. and have a > point blank-range of SEVENTY-ODD YARDS with birch arrows and SEVENTY > TO EIGHTY YARDS with bamboos. By ‘point-blank’ I mean that that range > at which the center of the target will be hit when aim is taken in > such a way that the arrowhead seems to rest on that center." > I don’t have access to the Archer’s Craft so I would like to ask > a couple of questions… > 1) please explain in words of one sylable what the above paragraph >    means.

Draw the bow, line the point of the arrow up with the gold, the point blank range is the distance at which the arrow hits the gold given the above aim. > 2) Does the book talk about how frequently Mr. Hodgkin practices?

sorry I have not seen the book > 3) Does anyone here know of anyone who can fairly consistantly >    hit bullseyes at 70 yards?

Yes, I know at least one shooter (Olympic recurve) who can regularly hit the gold at 70 yards > Thank you for your time and trouble. > Robert

danny www http://euler.ntu.ac.uk/dk/dk.html

Response:

snip > Some how the gun shooters have > taken the phrase to mean shooting at short range.

It also has another meaning. When siting in a rifle, the point blank range is the distance which the bullet travels and does not rise or fall beyond a set measurement. For example, i site my .270 (actually my wife’s) in with zero at approx. 230 yds (if i can remember that is about 2 in. high at 100 yards with 130 grain bullets). The rise of the bullet is about 3.5 in. at 150 yds (approx.) and 4 in low at 280 yds. Theoretically my point blank range is 280 yds., which means that for a deer sized animal i do not have to aim high or low out to 280 yds (aim at the center of the chest and there is 4 in. above and 4 in. below of lung and heart). For small deer and antilope the range would have to be shortened (and the gun resighted) to give 3 in. high and low, and for larger game (moose, elk with a heavier bullet) it may be possible to go to +- 5 or 6 in. Using the point blank range takes a lot of worry out of range estimation at reasonalble distances. Of course you have to be able to see that far, but on the prarries and in the west that is a real possibility (also across fields).         Point blank range (this definition) may not be practical for archery but the methodology may be used to get rid of one or two site pins (say range 0 – 25 yds, 25 – 30 yds etc.) I can’t say much here, i shoot instinctively and have no concept of site pin dynamics (even when i did shoot with a site pin i used only one set at 20 yds, but how quickly we forget). Ray

Response: